DT recruits - may be top need

[blion72]

for some reason we have really missed in this area for a few years. Each year we seem to be in on players, and then they de-commit - sometimes under mysterious conditions. last year we lost McLean and Wilkins - who Clemson is glowing about now. this now a pretty big hole for next year. we lose AJ, AZ and Barney. I don't see a lot of depth or experience back for next year. what we lack is the big NT type player who will stuff the run and get up the field. I don't see anyone on the roster like that. we are blessed with DE's but not the interior.

looking at the 2016 class we just lost the one guy who seemed to fit this bill - Colon. There does not seem to be any guys in PA for the 2017 class. we need to get these guys nationally.

we now need to recruit at the top of the charts for a couple years at this position. We need ready to play DTs that can come in and make impact in first two years. had we not gotten so far behind, this would not be so critical.

what makes this position so hard for us to recruit? are we in the mix for any of these players in 2016 or 2017?

 

[Mister Magoo]

None of our recent excellent players at that position were elite DT recruits. Jordan Hill, DaQuan Jones, Austin Johnson and Zettel developed into outstanding players. Our current players/commits can do the same if they work hard enough.

 

[blion72]

None of our recent excellent players at that position were elite DT recruits. Jordan Hill, DaQuan Jones, Austin Johnson and Zettel developed into outstanding players. Our current players/commits can do the same if they work hard enough.

I am not disagreeing with your point, but all those players were able to intern under top players while they waited to play. We now need someone to come in and be effective on the depth chart in 2016 and 2017. my point is we lost the time to develop when we did not recruit well. I think Gaia and Dowery are seniors now (with eligibility next year) - so maybe that is plan B for the staff. it doesn't look like we have recruited anyone that fills the AJ spot (looking at BWI article). if we had recruited anyone like that during the 2015 class, we would have seen them on the field already in the rotation.

 

[dawgduice]

for some reason we have really missed in this area for a few years. Each year we seem to be in on players, and then they de-commit - sometimes under mysterious conditions. last year we lost McLean and Wilkins - who Clemson is glowing about now. this now a pretty big hole for next year. we lose AJ, AZ and Barney. I don't see a lot of depth or experience back for next year. what we lack is the big NT type player who will stuff the run and get up the field. I don't see anyone on the roster like that. we are blessed with DE's but not the interior.

looking at the 2016 class we just lost the one guy who seemed to fit this bill - Colon. There does not seem to be any guys in PA for the 2017 class. we need to get these guys nationally.

we now need to recruit at the top of the charts for a couple years at this position. We need ready to play DTs that can come in and make impact in first two years. had we not gotten so far behind, this would not be so critical.

what makes this position so hard for us to recruit? are we in the mix for any of these players in 2016 or 2017?

Well as someone once said "Penn State is not for everyone". So there's that

 

[blion72]

None of our recent excellent players at that position were elite DT recruits. Jordan Hill, DaQuan Jones, Austin Johnson and Zettel developed into outstanding players. Our current players/commits can do the same if they work hard enough.

I am not disagreeing with your point, but all those players were able to intern under top players while they waited to play. We now need someone to come in and be effective on the depth chart in 2016 and 2017. my point is we lost the time to develop when we did not recruit well. I think Gaia and Dowery are seniors now (with eligibility next year) - so maybe that is plan B for the staff. it doesn't look like we have recruited anyone that fills the AJ spot (looking at BWI article). if we had recruited anyone like that during the 2015 class, we would have seen them on the field already in the rotation.

 

[Rip_E_2_Joe_PA]

Please examine the high school DE recruits. Many of these folks are playing out of position. They are more natural DTs ... If you do this you may feel a little better.

 

[Judge Smails]

Parker Cothren will be a RS JR. Antoine White will be a RS soph. White in particular has shown flashes of excellent play. Staff loves Buchholz moving to DT.

I think we have recruited 6 DTs (projected position at PSU) the last two classes. And Colon was the lowest ranked of our current DT recruits. We are young at the position, like many spots on this team, but there are kids with talent.

People were boo hooing about linebacker this year, and Reeder RS FR and Cabinda SO have been excellent.

But kudos on finding something to complain about today.

 

[cjrugger]

I am not disagreeing with your point, but all those players were able to intern under top players while they waited to play. We now need someone to come in and be effective on the depth chart in 2016 and 2017. my point is we lost the time to develop when we did not recruit well. I think Gaia and Dowery are seniors now (with eligibility next year) - so maybe that is plan B for the staff. it doesn't look like we have recruited anyone that fills the AJ spot (looking at BWI article). if we had recruited anyone like that during the 2015 class, we would have seen them on the field already in the rotation.

How is taut different than Cothren, White, Carter and Windsor 'interning' under AJ and AZ?

 

[GregInPitt]

This thread is about the same as one a few days ago. There is no way to replace two all B10 DT's without experiencing at least some dropoff in DT play.

As you guys have pointed out, we have two DT's coming back, Cothren and White, that are getting great experience this year. Cothren, last year as well.

It's not ideal to only have 2 DT's with experience. But we have 3 DT's redshirting that are playing on the scout team and will be ready to begin their on the field career last year. Windsor, Buchholz, and Carter. People were crying about their lack of size, as Buchholz was listed originally in the 250's. But by the time they hit the field in 2016 I'm betting they are each between 280 and 300 lbs. Windsor was already listed in the 280's as a true frosh. Rumor is that Buchholz is already in the 270's, and that Carter is close to 280.

We also have 3 nice DT recruits in the 2016 class (Jordan, Dioubate, and Dwumfour) so 1 or 2 of them could play as true frosh if it is necessary. If CJF picks up a JC DT yet for the 2016 class all 3 of them will likely redshirt.

I don't see Dowrey or Gaia moving to DT for their RS Sr years, 2016. The interior OL will still be thin, and would also be extremely young if one or both of them were to move to DT. At this point, and with the DT's we already have, they both would likely be backups at DT. I believe they are more needed on the OL, and have a better chance to contribute there as well.

It would be great to get a JC DT that could enroll in January and be ready to contribute in 2016, but I don't see DT as the top need to finish the 2016 class. A top punter (already committed) and a top kicker (already committed and hopefully signing in jan.) are the top needs to improve the team in the short term.

I'd like to see another LB, OL, DT, and big DB, and one WR, to finish the 2016 class.

Regarding the 2017 class, it's likely that a couple DT's will be in the class, but depth at all positions are likely to be addressed in the class, likely limited in numbers due to the 85 max scholarship limit. I still think that the 2017 class should include 2 QB's so we can more quickly get to 5 scholarship QB's in the program

 

[Eurotrash1]

I think quality DT's are a rare commodity. Therefore, we are competing with a large number of schools for limited bodies.

 

[b&w1987]

How is taut different than Cothren, White, Carter and Windsor 'interning' under AJ and AZ?

Reeder was awesome yesterday I kept wondering why that short #42 wasn't on the field all the time. Has a nose for the ball and makes plays.

 

[81b&w]

5 scholarship QB's in the program

Really? what kind of quality you gonna get when you're at #4 and 5? I think 4 is plenty

 

[royboy]

Parker Cothren will be a RS JR. Antoine White will be a RS soph. White in particular has shown flashes of excellent play. Staff loves Buchholz moving to DT.

I think we have recruited 6 DTs (projected position at PSU) the last two classes. And Colon was the lowest ranked of our current DT recruits. We are young at the position, like many spots on this team, but there are kids with talent.
.

Yeah, I also really like #19, Torrence Brown. He's a redshirt freshman from Alabama, moves well, seems to have a nose for the ball when he's in...had 3 tackles yesterday, including two tackles for loss. Looks like a classic developing D-lineman --- has a big frame and should be able to add good weight. He's listed at 250# and might be more than that already.

There's talent in the program on the D-line. Just need some additional experience and physical development.

 

[TheGLOV]

Anybody hear anything about that JC prospect that was very interested in us a while back?

 

[Doc-M]

Coach Franklin is a great recruiter but it will take additional year or two to have sufficient depth. Remember players grow out of their positions as well.

 

[BBrown]

for some reason we have really missed in this area for a few years. Each year we seem to be in on players, and then they de-commit - sometimes under mysterious conditions. last year we lost McLean and Wilkins - who Clemson is glowing about now. this now a pretty big hole for next year. we lose AJ, AZ and Barney. I don't see a lot of depth or experience back for next year. what we lack is the big NT type player who will stuff the run and get up the field. I don't see anyone on the roster like that. we are blessed with DE's but not the interior.

looking at the 2016 class we just lost the one guy who seemed to fit this bill - Colon. There does not seem to be any guys in PA for the 2017 class. we need to get these guys nationally.

we now need to recruit at the top of the charts for a couple years at this position. We need ready to play DTs that can come in and make impact in first two years. had we not gotten so far behind, this would not be so critical.

what makes this position so hard for us to recruit? are we in the mix for any of these players in 2016 or 2017?

My guess is, and we will see this pop up in other areas, is the limited amount of schollies really forced the coaches hands to over recruit for one area and thus under recruit for another. For instance 2 years ago we had to go really heavy on DB's, last year it was Oline', because of that it left our LB'rs thin and now DT.
Its going to take at least 2 full recruiting cycles to get back to where we can just start filling positions in and not recruiting an entire unit. But thats JMO.

 

[Judge Smails]

Fred Hansard, Princeton NJ, Rivals Top 100, 4 star, national #5 DT in 2017 class...

 

[anon_xdc8rmuek44eq]

Re-watching the game after my little one hit the sack last night (early too, thanks Daylight Savings!!) and I was really impressed with the guys we have coming back at DT/DE next year, especially T. Brown, Cothren, and Cothran. Schwan is built like Nassib, but hasn't been as effective - who knows, maybe he breaks out next year. Also, lots of young depth, especially at DE with Carter, Miller, Givens and Buchholz (who I guess is destined for DT). Add in possible contribution from the true freshmen (Simmons, Diobute, Jordan), and we should be in good shape with good LB's (Bell, Wartman-White, Reeder, Bowen, Cooper, Cabinda) and one of the best secondaries in the country helping out. Still think we need another DT, and this Hansard guy looks like a great fit. Of course, if Johnson comes back next year, we'd be in really, really good shape....

 

[GregInPitt]

Really? what kind of quality you gonna get when you're at #4 and 5? I think 4 is plenty

Franklin said he wants 5 scholarship QB's in the program

 

[81b&w]

well, he's the coach. you think we need 5?

 

[lionsblood242]

No way. Also- nassib makes this point sound silly, but for some reason I feel like DTs are easier to develop than DEs. Like someone said earlier, all of our really good recent ones have been developed after not being big recruits. Not too worried about lack of DT commitss...

 

[GregInPitt]

Franklin said he wants 5 scholarship QB's in the program

QB is a position where the backups really don't get meaningful playing time. So high rated recruits, that don't pan out or are stuck behind a multi year starter, tend to transfer. So it's hard to keep 5 quality QB's in the program at the same time. But it seems to me that CJF plans to try and keep 2 or 3 true frosh or redshirt frosh in the program and then if one transfers he still has 4. I think we need to recruit at least one every year and two some years. Some that don't play will transfer to a situation where they can play.

We have been fortunate lately in that our QB's have not gotten hurt. But if you have 4 or 5 and 2 get hurt, than you really don't have adequate depth. I think that's why CJF wants 5, and I agree. It's the most important position on a football team, and it does not make sense to be caught short on QB talent.

 

[KnightWhoSaysNit]

If the offense is to look like what we saw when McSorely was playing, then we will need 3 ready to play, and 2 more being groomed while underclassmen. Look at what has happened to OSU over the last few years. If any of their top 3 were not ready then they don't have the same success. One gets into trouble, another injury, maybe another is in a slump or not the best fit. They had it all. Why would any other team expect to have better luck when the offensive style puts the QB at just as much risk (or more) compared to a running back? And just about any other team would not have the same supporting cast. So, if #1 is the goal, one must have the numbers at QB.