Death Threat to PSU Beta Members

[LafayetteBear]

Earlier today, Lt. Robb of the State College Police Department contacted attorneys for the Beta members facing criminal charges in connection with Tim Piazza's death, and informed them that the University President's office received an anonymous telephone call yesterday in which the caller stated:

"If Penn State allows any of the Beta brothers involved in this case back onto campus, they will take them out."

This subject is mentioned briefly in an ABC News article posted in the "Beta Theta Pi hearing marathon" thread on this Board, but the news article is a bit vague, and indicates that State College Police Department "refused to comment."

Refused to comment?! For several months now, Stacy Parks Miller has been attempting to try these young men in the media, likely with an eye towards positioning herself as a "law and order" DA best suited for reelection to her office. She has refused to return to the Beta Housing Corporation (which she also persuaded the grand jury to indict) either the original or an unmodified (i.e., "forensic") copy of the video taken on Beta house cameras, all while making numerous incendiary statements about what it supposedly depicts. She is now reported to be appealing a court order directing her to do so and threatening to hold her in contempt of court.

Ms. Parks Miller's efforts to try these young men in the media have been abetted considerably by Jim and Evelyn Piazza, who have variously described the Beta brothers as having committed "murder" and "torture," among other inaccurate and overwrought assertions. Their grief is understandable and they deserve considerable sympathy, but the scorched earth campaign they have conducted against these young men has gone way over the top.

As the parent of a Beta member, albeit one who is not (to use the anonymous caller's words) "involved in this case" and not facing any criminal charges, my focus has now shifted a bit. My prior sympathy for the Piazzas (and my concern that the trial of these young men would be rendered a mockery by a deeply tainted jury pool), has now largely been replaced by concern for the physical safety of my son and his roommates and friends. The University and the State College Police may not want to discuss this death threat, but I certainly hope they will take it seriously.

And BTW, thank you, Stacy Parks Miller, Jim Piazza, and Evelyn Piazza.

 

[PSU_Nut]

While I don't condone the death threats why not teach your kid a lesson instead of tying to start a pity party? He chose to pay to be a member of this organization that hazed members to join and who had a house manager who was selling drugs out of the house. Are you going to pretend he didn't know what was going on? Perhaps you should tell him to choose his friends and what organizations he joins better. If you are worried about his safety there is a simple solution, transfer. Instead of blaming others why not tell him to take personal responsibility for being part of a terrible organization. The Piazzas and the DA didn't force him to become a beta. Instead of personal responsibility you want to turn your son and his "brothers" as victims.

 

[Chickenman Testa]

Earlier today, Lt. Robb of the State College Police Department contacted attorneys for the Beta members facing criminal charges in connection with Tim Piazza's death, and informed them that the University President's office received an anonymous telephone call yesterday in which the caller stated:

"If Penn State allows any of the Beta brothers involved in this case back onto campus, they will take them out."

This subject is mentioned briefly in an ABC News article posted in the "Beta Theta Pi hearing marathon" thread on this Board, but the news article is a bit vague, and indicates that State College Police Department "refused to comment."

Refused to comment?! For several months now, Stacy Parks Miller has been attempting to try these young men in the media, likely with an eye towards positioning herself as a "law and order" DA best suited for reelection to her office. She has refused to return to the Beta Housing Corporation (which she also persuaded the grand jury to indict) either the original or an unmodified (i.e., "forensic") copy of the video taken on Beta house cameras, all while making numerous incendiary statements about what it supposedly depicts. She is now reported to be appealing a court order directing her to do so and threatening to hold her in contempt of court.

Ms. Parks Miller's efforts to try these young men in the media have been abetted considerably by Jim and Evelyn Piazza, who have variously described the Beta brothers as having committed "murder" and "torture," among other inaccurate and overwrought assertions. Their grief is understandable and they deserve considerable sympathy, but the scorched earth campaign they have conducted against these young men has gone way over the top.

As the parent of a Beta member, albeit one who is not (to use the anonymous caller's words) "involved in this case" and not facing any criminal charges, my focus has now shifted a bit. My prior sympathy for the Piazzas (and my concern that the trial of these young men would be rendered a mockery by a deeply tainted jury pool), has now largely been replaced by concern for the physical safety of my son and his roommates and friends. The University and the State College Police may not want to discuss this death threat, but I certainly hope they will take it seriously.

And BTW, thank you, Stacy Parks Miller, Jim Piazza, and Evelyn Piazza.

And thank you BETA for being the crappy out of control Frat you were (emphasis on were).

PSUNUT has it dead right.

 

[EPC FAN]

While I don't condone the death threats why not teach your kid a lesson instead of tying to start a pity party? He chose to pay to be a member of this organization that hazed members to join and who had a president who was selling drugs out of the house. Are you going to pretend he didn't know what was going on? Perhaps you should tell him to choose his friends and what organizations he joins better. If you are worried about his safety there is a simple solution, transfer. Instead of blaming others why not tell him to take personal responsibility for being part of a terrible organization. The Piazzas and the DA didn't force him to become a beta. Instead of personal responsibility you want to turn your son and his "brothers" as victims.

With the benefit of hindsight, anyone can be a self righteous know it all.

 

[PSU Soupy]

While I don't condone the death threats why not teach your kid a lesson instead of tying to start a pity party? He chose to pay to be a member of this organization that hazed members to join and who had a president who was selling drugs out of the house. Are you going to pretend he didn't know what was going on? Perhaps you should tell him to choose his friends and what organizations he joins better. If you are worried about his safety there is a simple solution, transfer. Instead of blaming others why not tell him to take personal responsibility for being part of a terrible organization. The Piazzas and the DA didn't force him to become a beta. Instead of personal responsibility you want to turn your son and his "brothers" as victims.

With this message....your name is a good fit. So this boy should transfer away from PSU because he was in Beta and had nothing to do with the Piazza situation, but because he was a BETA he should transfer?? Perhaps Tom Brady should have left the Patriots and gone to another team due to this organization selecting/drafting a 3 time killer in Hernandez. Certainly Tom Brady or Gronk should have known about Hernandez........

This whole situation is sad and mistakes were made on so many levels, certainly the BETA guys made numerous mistakes and they are paying for it by being kicked out of their home, being vilified on campus. The boys at BETA are paying for their stupidity through the aggressive actions of the DA.....lets not pile on even more.

 

[humpydudas19]

With this message....your name is a good fit. So this boy should transfer away from PSU because he was in Beta and had nothing to do with the Piazza situation, but because he was a BETA he should transfer?? Perhaps Tom Brady should have left the Patriots and gone to another team due to this organization selecting/drafting a 3 time killer in Hernandez. Certainly Tom Brady or Gronk should have known about Hernandez........

This whole situation is sad and mistakes were made on so many levels, certainly the BETA guys made numerous mistakes and they are paying for it by being kicked out of their home, being vilified on campus. The boys at BETA are paying for their stupidity through the aggressive actions of the DA.....lets not pile on even more.

Yes, Joe should have left after all the death threats by phone and telegram in '76 in Pittsburgh. PSU_Nut is an asshole supreme.

 

[Langmuir]

And here I thought the Sandusky situation would have taught us not to jump to conclusions and be judgmental a-holes. I guess I was wrong.

 

[MtNittany]

The SPM cheerleaders would think differently if they were on the wrong end of one of her publicity based prosecutions.

 

[PSU_Nut]

With this message....your name is a good fit. So this boy should transfer away from PSU because he was in Beta and had nothing to do with the Piazza situation, but because he was a BETA he should transfer?? Perhaps Tom Brady should have left the Patriots and gone to another team due to this organization selecting/drafting a 3 time killer in Hernandez. Certainly Tom Brady or Gronk should have known about Hernandez........

This whole situation is sad and mistakes were made on so many levels, certainly the BETA guys made numerous mistakes and they are paying for it by being kicked out of their home, being vilified on campus. The boys at Beta are paying for their stupidity through the aggressive actions of the DA.....lets not pile on even more.

I said if he is that worried about his son's safety he should transfer not try to . I never said he should just transfer because he was a Beta. I don't condone the death threats and those making the should be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law.

 

[BobPSU92]

PSUNUT has it dead right.

There's a first time for everything. Never to be repeated.

 

[BobPSU92]

And here I thought the Sandusky situation would have taught us not to jump to conclusions and be judgmental a-holes. I guess I was wrong.

People MUST. BE. OUTRAGED. regardless of the facts.

OUTRAGE.

 

[PSU_Nut]

With the benefit of hindsight, anyone can be a self righteous know it all.

Since when do you need hindsight to know that being part of an organization that involves hazing and has a president that deals drugs out of the house is a bad idea? Has society gotten to the point that we can not expect people to evaluate a situation and think this might not turn out well? People love making excuses for everything.

 

[psu2016]

While I don't condone the death threats why not teach your kid a lesson instead of tying to start a pity party? He chose to pay to be a member of this organization that hazed members to join and who had a president who was selling drugs out of the house. Are you going to pretend he didn't know what was going on? Perhaps you should tell him to choose his friends and what organizations he joins better. If you are worried about his safety there is a simple solution, transfer. Instead of blaming others why not tell him to take personal responsibility for being part of a terrible organization. The Piazzas and the DA didn't force him to become a beta. Instead of personal responsibility you want to turn your son and his "brothers" as victims.

If you think Beta is unique in hazing, drinking, and drug use among fraternities at Penn State and around the country, you are mistaken. And I doubt it was much different 10, 20, or 30 years ago.

 

[BBrown]

Earlier today, Lt. Robb of the State College Police Department contacted attorneys for the Beta members facing criminal charges in connection with Tim Piazza's death, and informed them that the University President's office received an anonymous telephone call yesterday in which the caller stated:

"If Penn State allows any of the Beta brothers involved in this case back onto campus, they will take them out."

This subject is mentioned briefly in an ABC News article posted in the "Beta Theta Pi hearing marathon" thread on this Board, but the news article is a bit vague, and indicates that State College Police Department "refused to comment."

Refused to comment?! For several months now, Stacy Parks Miller has been attempting to try these young men in the media, likely with an eye towards positioning herself as a "law and order" DA best suited for reelection to her office. She has refused to return to the Beta Housing Corporation (which she also persuaded the grand jury to indict) either the original or an unmodified (i.e., "forensic") copy of the video taken on Beta house cameras, all while making numerous incendiary statements about what it supposedly depicts. She is now reported to be appealing a court order directing her to do so and threatening to hold her in contempt of court.

Ms. Parks Miller's efforts to try these young men in the media have been abetted considerably by Jim and Evelyn Piazza, who have variously described the Beta brothers as having committed "murder" and "torture," among other inaccurate and overwrought assertions. Their grief is understandable and they deserve considerable sympathy, but the scorched earth campaign they have conducted against these young men has gone way over the top.

As the parent of a Beta member, albeit one who is not (to use the anonymous caller's words) "involved in this case" and not facing any criminal charges, my focus has now shifted a bit. My prior sympathy for the Piazzas (and my concern that the trial of these young men would be rendered a mockery by a deeply tainted jury pool), has now largely been replaced by concern for the physical safety of my son and his roommates and friends. The University and the State College Police may not want to discuss this death threat, but I certainly hope they will take it seriously.

And BTW, thank you, Stacy Parks Miller, Jim Piazza, and Evelyn Piazza.

Hmmm anyone see a plane with a banner? How does Surma feel about this?

 

[BBrown]

With the benefit of hindsight, anyone can be a self righteous know it all.

Yea PSU_Nut sure seems to have the "pulse" of whats going on on campus and around town. I wonder why he hasn't done anything? hmmmm.

 

[Mack_Daddy]

While I don't condone the death threats why not teach your kid a lesson instead of tying to start a pity party? He chose to pay to be a member of this organization that hazed members to join and who had a president who was selling drugs out of the house. Are you going to pretend he didn't know what was going on? Perhaps you should tell him to choose his friends and what organizations he joins better. If you are worried about his safety there is a simple solution, transfer. Instead of blaming others why not tell him to take personal responsibility for being part of a terrible organization. The Piazzas and the DA didn't force him to become a beta. Instead of personal responsibility you want to turn your son and his "brothers" as victims.

 

[Mack_Daddy]

Earlier today, Lt. Robb of the State College Police Department contacted attorneys for the Beta members facing criminal charges in connection with Tim Piazza's death, and informed them that the University President's office received an anonymous telephone call yesterday in which the caller stated:

"If Penn State allows any of the Beta brothers involved in this case back onto campus, they will take them out."

This subject is mentioned briefly in an ABC News article posted in the "Beta Theta Pi hearing marathon" thread on this Board, but the news article is a bit vague, and indicates that State College Police Department "refused to comment."

Refused to comment?! For several months now, Stacy Parks Miller has been attempting to try these young men in the media, likely with an eye towards positioning herself as a "law and order" DA best suited for reelection to her office. She has refused to return to the Beta Housing Corporation (which she also persuaded the grand jury to indict) either the original or an unmodified (i.e., "forensic") copy of the video taken on Beta house cameras, all while making numerous incendiary statements about what it supposedly depicts. She is now reported to be appealing a court order directing her to do so and threatening to hold her in contempt of court.

Ms. Parks Miller's efforts to try these young men in the media have been abetted considerably by Jim and Evelyn Piazza, who have variously described the Beta brothers as having committed "murder" and "torture," among other inaccurate and overwrought assertions. Their grief is understandable and they deserve considerable sympathy, but the scorched earth campaign they have conducted against these young men has gone way over the top.

As the parent of a Beta member, albeit one who is not (to use the anonymous caller's words) "involved in this case" and not facing any criminal charges, my focus has now shifted a bit. My prior sympathy for the Piazzas (and my concern that the trial of these young men would be rendered a mockery by a deeply tainted jury pool), has now largely been replaced by concern for the physical safety of my son and his roommates and friends. The University and the State College Police may not want to discuss this death threat, but I certainly hope they will take it seriously.

And BTW, thank you, Stacy Parks Miller, Jim Piazza, and Evelyn Piazza.

You must be new to Planet Earth. So, I will fill you in.

On this planet, Naked Apes can (and usually do) give death threats. It's a part of their African Ape DNA.

Try the veal before you go. Its to die for.

http://www.businessinsider.com/statistics-on-twitter-abuse-rape-death-threats-and-trolls-2015-4

 

[BlueBand]

With this message....your name is a good fit. So this boy should transfer away from PSU because he was in Beta and had nothing to do with the Piazza situation, but because he was a BETA he should transfer?? Perhaps Tom Brady should have left the Patriots and gone to another team due to this organization selecting/drafting a 3 time killer in Hernandez. Certainly Tom Brady or Gronk should have known about Hernandez........

This whole situation is sad and mistakes were made on so many levels, certainly the BETA guys made numerous mistakes and they are paying for it by being kicked out of their home, being vilified on campus. The boys at BETA are paying for their stupidity through the aggressive actions of the DA.....lets not pile on even more.

He should transfer if he's that worried about his safety. They made mistakes, they're paying the price. Even if he wasn't directly involved, assuming he hadn't removed himself completely from the frat activities, what was going on there was known by the members.

The university notified them of the threat, they notified the police. What more would you suggest they do? Escort them around campus with security? The person making the threat, if they can be found, should be dealt with as the law allows. But the actions (or inactions) of the frat led to this.

Guess what? Life isn't always fair. A good lesson for a young man to learn. If this is the worst thing he had to experience, he's lucky. He's alive. He's uninjured. He has the opportunity to move forward wiser, and start over if need be somewhere else. The dead man doesn't get that luxury. Neither, it would appear, are those who were directly involved and are facing serious charges.

You may feel the actions of the DA are aggressive. Maybe that was needed to get people's attention. Maybe an example needed to be made to prevent future tragedies. A young man DIED as a direct result of the actions and choices these young men made. It doesn't get more serious than that. This wasn't some party where one person drank too much on their own, and had an accident, and help was called right away but couldn't save him. The alcohol was provided knowingly to a minor, as a part of illegal hazing, and when the young man fell down the stairs, on more than one occasion he was left essentially to die. You don't think that warrants an "aggressive" approach to the situation?

 

[BlueBand]

If you think Beta is unique in hazing, drinking, and drug use among fraternities at Penn State and around the country, you are mistaken. And I doubt it was much different 10, 20, or 30 years ago.

That doesn't make it right.

 

[Vermilion]

It was not the Beta President dealing pot, it was another brother. I just find it hard to believe these boys will receive a fair trial. At least in the media and social media, they have been found guilty before even presenting any sort of defense

 

[PSU_Nut]

If you think Beta is unique in hazing, drinking, and drug use among fraternities at Penn State and around the country, you are mistaken. And I doubt it was much different 10, 20, or 30 years ago.

So should we have a pity party for those people who choose to join them when things go wrong? If you chose to join organizations who participate those activities don't come crying when they end up with terrible consequences. That is my entire point. I know Beta is not the only fraternity to participate in these activities however when they go wrong don't blame the DA or the victims parents for the repercussions. I sure his son had no problem with the benefits that came from being a member but now wants a pass from the repercussions of the activity his organization chose to participate in.

 

[MtNittany]

At least in the media and social media, they have been found guilty before even presenting any sort of defense

Welcome to Pennsylvania!

 

[PSU_Nut]

It was not the Beta President dealing pot, it was another brother. I just find it hard to believe these boys will receive a fair trial. At least in the media and social media, they have been found guilty before even presenting any sort of defense

You are correct. It was the house manager.

 

[Elwood Blues]

The SPM cheerleaders would think differently if they were on the wrong end of one of her publicity based prosecutions.

Are there any? Seriously...based upon vote totals, there are darn few.

 

[cvilleelkscoach]

Earlier today, Lt. Robb of the State College Police Department contacted attorneys for the Beta members facing criminal charges in connection with Tim Piazza's death, and informed them that the University President's office received an anonymous telephone call yesterday in which the caller stated:

"If Penn State allows any of the Beta brothers involved in this case back onto campus, they will take them out."

This subject is mentioned briefly in an ABC News article posted in the "Beta Theta Pi hearing marathon" thread on this Board, but the news article is a bit vague, and indicates that State College Police Department "refused to comment."

Refused to comment?! For several months now, Stacy Parks Miller has been attempting to try these young men in the media, likely with an eye towards positioning herself as a "law and order" DA best suited for reelection to her office. She has refused to return to the Beta Housing Corporation (which she also persuaded the grand jury to indict) either the original or an unmodified (i.e., "forensic") copy of the video taken on Beta house cameras, all while making numerous incendiary statements about what it supposedly depicts. She is now reported to be appealing a court order directing her to do so and threatening to hold her in contempt of court.

Ms. Parks Miller's efforts to try these young men in the media have been abetted considerably by Jim and Evelyn Piazza, who have variously described the Beta brothers as having committed "murder" and "torture," among other inaccurate and overwrought assertions. Their grief is understandable and they deserve considerable sympathy, but the scorched earth campaign they have conducted against these young men has gone way over the top.

As the parent of a Beta member, albeit one who is not (to use the anonymous caller's words) "involved in this case" and not facing any criminal charges, my focus has now shifted a bit. My prior sympathy for the Piazzas (and my concern that the trial of these young men would be rendered a mockery by a deeply tainted jury pool), has now largely been replaced by concern for the physical safety of my son and his roommates and friends. The University and the State College Police may not want to discuss this death threat, but I certainly hope they will take it seriously.

And BTW, thank you, Stacy Parks Miller, Jim Piazza, and Evelyn Piazza.

While I don't condone the actions of attention whore SPM, I'm somewhat sympathetic to the Piazzas in their time of grief.

Did your son go through the gauntlet as an acceptee? What other drinking events were held during his pledging?

 

[NittPicker]

This subject is mentioned briefly in an ABC News article posted in the "Beta Theta Pi hearing marathon" thread on this Board, but the news article is a bit vague, and indicates that State College Police Department "refused to comment".

To veer a bit off topic, that kind of attitude really pisses me off. It's becoming more common everyday to hear spokesmen for public service agencies act like they don't owe the public anything. Everything is such a big damned secret nowadays, or at least they think so. So SCPD refused to comment on death threats? I understand the notion of not wanting to compromise an investigation but how hard would it be to say something along the lines of, "A major duty of the State College Police Department is to protect the safety of all persons who are living in or visiting State College. Specific active investigations cannot be discussed but generally speaking, we do not condone threats of violence directed toward any person. Any such threats will be investigated and criminal charges will be filed when appropriate."

 

[ThePennsyOracle]

He should transfer if he's that worried about his safety. They made mistakes, they're paying the price. Even if he wasn't directly involved, assuming he hadn't removed himself completely from the frat activities, what was going on there was known by the members.

The university notified them of the threat, they notified the police. What more would you suggest they do? Escort them around campus with security? The person making the threat, if they can be found, should be dealt with as the law allows. But the actions (or inactions) of the frat led to this.

Guess what? Life isn't always fair. A good lesson for a young man to learn. If this is the worst thing he had to experience, he's lucky. He's alive. He's uninjured. He has the opportunity to move forward wiser, and start over if need be somewhere else. The dead man doesn't get that luxury. Neither, it would appear, are those who were directly involved and are facing serious charges.

You may feel the actions of the DA are aggressive. Maybe that was needed to get people's attention. Maybe an example needed to be made to prevent future tragedies. A young man DIED as a direct result of the actions and choices these young men made. It doesn't get more serious than that. This wasn't some party where one person drank too much on their own, and had an accident, and help was called right away but couldn't save him. The alcohol was provided knowingly to a minor, as a part of illegal hazing, and when the young man fell down the stairs, on more than one occasion he was left essentially to die. You don't think that warrants an "aggressive" approach to the situation?

The young man died as a result of his actions. He made an awful lot of stupid choices. No one forced him to join a frat, no one forced him to join Beta, no one forced him to drink underage, no one forced him to participate in hazing rituals, and no one forced him to drink to that level of excess. Tim Piazza had the opportunity to take many left turns during this ordeal and CHOSE not to do so. If he never fell, he'd be perpetuating the very same disgusting hazing activities.

That said, he didn't deserve to die and the actions of others that night are questionable at best, criminal at worst. That's for a judge & jury to decide--not me.

Let's call it like it is: Piazza made a ton of idiotic choices, and the frat bros made idiotic choices. The result of said terrible choices, on both sides, is tragic.

 

[Elwood Blues]

To veer a bit off topic, that kind of attitude really pisses me off. It's becoming more common everyday to hear spokesmen for public service agencies act like they don't owe the public anything. Everything is such a big damned secret nowadays, or at least they think so. So SCPD refused to comment on death threats? I understand the notion of not wanting to compromise an investigation but how hard would it be to say something along the lines of, "A major duty of the State College Police Department is to protect the safety of all persons who are living in or visiting State College. Specific active investigations cannot be discussed but generally speaking, we do not condone threats of violence directed toward any person. Any such threats will be investigated and criminal charges will be filed when appropriate."

Many people / organizations refuse comment because past experience indicates a high likelihood that the news outlet will, deliberately or through sheer incompetence, completely distort any statement that is made.

 

[fairgambit]

Earlier today, Lt. Robb of the State College Police Department contacted attorneys for the Beta members facing criminal charges in connection with Tim Piazza's death, and informed them that the University President's office received an anonymous telephone call yesterday in which the caller stated:

"If Penn State allows any of the Beta brothers involved in this case back onto campus, they will take them out."

This subject is mentioned briefly in an ABC News article posted in the "Beta Theta Pi hearing marathon" thread on this Board, but the news article is a bit vague, and indicates that State College Police Department "refused to comment."

Refused to comment?! For several months now, Stacy Parks Miller has been attempting to try these young men in the media, likely with an eye towards positioning herself as a "law and order" DA best suited for reelection to her office. She has refused to return to the Beta Housing Corporation (which she also persuaded the grand jury to indict) either the original or an unmodified (i.e., "forensic") copy of the video taken on Beta house cameras, all while making numerous incendiary statements about what it supposedly depicts. She is now reported to be appealing a court order directing her to do so and threatening to hold her in contempt of court.

Ms. Parks Miller's efforts to try these young men in the media have been abetted considerably by Jim and Evelyn Piazza, who have variously described the Beta brothers as having committed "murder" and "torture," among other inaccurate and overwrought assertions. Their grief is understandable and they deserve considerable sympathy, but the scorched earth campaign they have conducted against these young men has gone way over the top.

As the parent of a Beta member, albeit one who is not (to use the anonymous caller's words) "involved in this case" and not facing any criminal charges, my focus has now shifted a bit. My prior sympathy for the Piazzas (and my concern that the trial of these young men would be rendered a mockery by a deeply tainted jury pool), has now largely been replaced by concern for the physical safety of my son and his roommates and friends. The University and the State College Police may not want to discuss this death threat, but I certainly hope they will take it seriously.

And BTW, thank you, Stacy Parks Miller, Jim Piazza, and Evelyn Piazza.

There is a lynch mob mentality in this country that is getting worse. Many people hear a 30 second sound bite, make a judgment as to guilt or innocence, and move on, carrying their conclusions with them and passing them on to others. It is appalling and it is out of control.

 

[BUFFALO LION]

While I don't condone the death threats why not teach your kid a lesson instead of tying to start a pity party? He chose to pay to be a member of this organization that hazed members to join and who had a president who was selling drugs out of the house. Are you going to pretend he didn't know what was going on? Perhaps you should tell him to choose his friends and what organizations he joins better. If you are worried about his safety there is a simple solution, transfer. Instead of blaming others why not tell him to take personal responsibility for being part of a terrible organization. The Piazzas and the DA didn't force him to become a beta. Instead of personal responsibility you want to turn your son and his "brothers" as victims.

You sure that wasn't the House Manager dealing the drugs? I don't remember their President being involved in that, but I could be wrong.

I haven't had the time to follow the case that closely, but if our House Manager would have been dealing drugs back in the early 70s, number one, I doubt any pledge or rushee would have known about it, and number two, if any of the rest of us would have found out about it, his a$$ would have been kicked out of the House faster than your head could spin.

And as far as your holier than thou preaching about hazing, me and thousands of other guys went through the same things this kid went through. We all knew what we were getting into and accepted it. Some of us actually loved it and ate it up.

When you are an 18 or 19 year old, testosterone infected male, horny for the best looking girls on campus, you will run through a wall to get an edge. Being in a Fraternity actually gave me more discipline when dealing with girls, and people in general, than before I joined.

If that kid would have gotten drunk and fallen over a balcony at some apartment party, you would have never heard about this. But because it happened at a Fraternity, which some of you had a problem with because we got all the best looking women, it gives you an excuse to bitch.

The fact this kid accidentally fell down the steps and died doing a "House Run", if that's what it was, voluntarily, is beyond horrible. But most of us that we're in fraternities have done some version of the same thing, and would do it again in a heartbeat. I would. Not because I liked the "House Run" or the hazing. But because I liked the benefits it brought along with it.

If I was lucky enough to be an 18 or 19 year old kid again, what do you think I would rather do? Go through pledging again with all the hazing involved so I can get my pick of the hottest girls on campus? Or stay in the dorms having to meet transient friends every year and having to go to apartment parties with a 10 to 1 guy to girl ratio? You be the judge. Every time I get in a car, I know I can be killed, but I do it anyway, because it gets me where I want to go.

Lay off these kids. They aren't any different than you or I were at that age. I'll bet you have some skeletons in your past too.

 

[BUFFALO LION]

You are correct. It was the house manager.

Ok. So you did try to exaggerate the situation. Not suprised at all.

Lot of difference between the House Manager and the President. Neither one should be dealing drugs. But the House Manager is NOT the "President".

 

[fairgambit]

He should transfer if he's that worried about his safety. They made mistakes, they're paying the price. Even if he wasn't directly involved, assuming he hadn't removed himself completely from the frat activities, what was going on there was known by the members.
A young man DIED as a direct result of the actions and choices these young men made.
The alcohol was provided knowingly to a minor, as a part of illegal hazing, and when the young man fell down the stairs, on more than one occasion he was left essentially to die.

Now that you, and others, have all the answers, can we just get rid of that archaic, unreasonable part of our Constitution known as the 6th Amendment and just lynch these guys?

Amendment VI
In all criminal prosecutions, the accused shall enjoy the right to a speedy and public trial, by an impartial jury of the state and district wherein the crime shall have been committed, which district shall have been previously ascertained by law, and to be informed of the nature and cause of the accusation; to be confronted with the witnesses against him; to have compulsory process for obtaining witnesses in his favor, and to have the assistance of counsel for his defense.

 

[Chickenman Testa]

You sure that wasn't the House Manager dealing the drugs? I don't remember their President being involved in that, but I could be wrong.

I haven't had the time to follow the case that closely, but if our House Manager would have been dealing drugs back in the early 70s, number one, I doubt any pledge or rushee would have known about it, and number two, if any of the rest of us would have found out about it, his a$$ would have been kicked out of the House faster than your head could spin.

And as far as your holier than thou preaching about hazing, me and thousands of other guys went through the same things this kid went through. We all knew what we were getting into and accepted it. Some of us actually loved it and ate it up.

When you are an 18 or 19 year old, testosterone infected male, horny for the best looking girls on campus, you will run through a wall to get an edge. Being in a Fraternity actually gave me more discipline when dealing with girls, and people in general, than before I joined.

If that kid would have gotten drunk and fallen over a balcony at some apartment party, you would have never heard about this. But because it happened at a Fraternity, which some of you had a problem with because we got all the best looking women, it gives you an excuse to bitch.

The fact this kid accidentally fell down the steps and died doing a "House Run", if that's what it was, voluntarily, is beyond horrible. But most of us that we're in fraternities have done some version of the same thing, and would do it again in a heartbeat. I would. Not because I liked the "House Run" or the hazing. But because I liked the benefits it brought along with it.

If I was lucky enough to be an 18 or 19 year old kid again, what do you think I would rather do? Go through pledging again with all the hazing involved so I can get my pick of the hottest girls on campus? Or stay in the dorms having to meet transient friends every year and having to go to apartment parties with a 10 to 1 guy to girl ratio? You be the judge. Every time I get in a car, I know I can be killed, but I do it anyway, because it gets me where I want to go.

Lay off these kids. They aren't any different than you or I were at that age. I'll bet you have some skeletons in your past too.

Save teh Frat Bros!!!!

So you like Frat Bros, hazing and Jim Delany - quite a trifecta.

 

[Pardlion]

He chose to pay to be a member of this organization that hazed members

LOL at all of the sanctimonious know-nothings who think this is the greatest hazing conspiracy in the world. We're talking about a 45-minute event where pledges took a 5-second swig from a vodka bottle, and then chugged a few beers. On a scale of 1-10 in "hazing" this is like a -2. I can't even figure out how the kid got as drunk as was alleged. Does the video show all of the other pledges passing out from this incredible drinking event?

 

[Chickenman Testa]

LOL at all of the sanctimonious know-nothings who think this is the greatest hazing conspiracy in the world. We're talking about a 45-minute event where pledges took a 5-second swig from a vodka bottle, and then chugged a few beers. On a scale of 1-10 in "hazing" this is like a -2. I can't even figure out how the kid got as drunk as was alleged. Does the video show all of the other pledges passing out from this incredible drinking event?

And yet the frat boys tried to delete their texts about this non event

 

[Pardlion]

And yet the frat boys tried to delete their texts about this non event

Not an impressive fact.

 

[BUFFALO LION]

Save teh Frat Bros!!!!

So you like Frat Bros, hazing and Jim Delany - quite a trifecta.

Do I like the guys I spent most of my College life with??? Yep!!! Liked the guys I was with at Lyons Hall too, but most of us ended up in Fraternities.

Do I like you? Nope.

 

[BlueBand]

Now that you, and others, have all the answers, can we just get rid of that archaic, unreasonable part of our Constitution known as the 6th Amendment and just lynch these guys?

Amendment VI
In all criminal prosecutions, the accused shall enjoy the right to a speedy and public trial, by an impartial jury of the state and district wherein the crime shall have been committed, which district shall have been previously ascertained by law, and to be informed of the nature and cause of the accusation; to be confronted with the witnesses against him; to have compulsory process for obtaining witnesses in his favor, and to have the assistance of counsel for his defense.

Yes, innocent until proven guilty. But we all know that sometimes what's known about a case in public is pretty much enough to come to some conclusions. That doesn't mean we suspend their constitutional rights.

 

[Chickenman Testa]

Not an impressive fact.

But an inconvenient fact and one the police found impressive

 

[BlueBand]

You sure that wasn't the House Manager dealing the drugs? I don't remember their President being involved in that, but I could be wrong.

I haven't had the time to follow the case that closely, but if our House Manager would have been dealing drugs back in the early 70s, number one, I doubt any pledge or rushee would have known about it, and number two, if any of the rest of us would have found out about it, his a$$ would have been kicked out of the House faster than your head could spin.

And as far as your holier than thou preaching about hazing, me and thousands of other guys went through the same things this kid went through. We all knew what we were getting into and accepted it. Some of us actually loved it and ate it up.

When you are an 18 or 19 year old, testosterone infected male, horny for the best looking girls on campus, you will run through a wall to get an edge. Being in a Fraternity actually gave me more discipline when dealing with girls, and people in general, than before I joined.

If that kid would have gotten drunk and fallen over a balcony at some apartment party, you would have never heard about this. But because it happened at a Fraternity, which some of you had a problem with because we got all the best looking women, it gives you an excuse to bitch.

The fact this kid accidentally fell down the steps and died doing a "House Run", if that's what it was, voluntarily, is beyond horrible. But most of us that we're in fraternities have done some version of the same thing, and would do it again in a heartbeat. I would. Not because I liked the "House Run" or the hazing. But because I liked the benefits it brought along with it.

If I was lucky enough to be an 18 or 19 year old kid again, what do you think I would rather do? Go through pledging again with all the hazing involved so I can get my pick of the hottest girls on campus? Or stay in the dorms having to meet transient friends every year and having to go to apartment parties with a 10 to 1 guy to girl ratio? You be the judge. Every time I get in a car, I know I can be killed, but I do it anyway, because it gets me where I want to go.

Lay off these kids. They aren't any different than you or I were at that age. I'll bet you have some skeletons in your past too.

Sooooo... this boils down to you're at school to get laid, and you're not hot enough to get the hottest girls on your own, but by being in a frat you somehow are magically more appealing to the opposite sex. And that justifies behavior that got someone killed. Gotcha.