Changing a team name seems like a no brainer. Because the fan base regardless of beliefs...........

[Mr. Potter]

most, will by the new merchandise in volume that is in excess of what would otherwise be sold in every other year, no?

For an example if Penn State changed the Nitanny Lions changed to the penguins, I would buy a jersey or hat even though I would want to resist the name change.

Any Economic Pro's out there please enlighten me.

Shalom

 

[ouirpsu]

I look at it like this - If Yankees fans can accept Wade Boggs, Redskins fans can accept a new name.

 

[JoeBot409]

Do the Chiefs need to change their name? What about Blackhawks?

 

[Mr. Potter]

Do the Chiefs need to change their name? What about Blackhawks?

If that name is derogatory to Native Americans I would, wouldn't you?

 

[Beachwineguy]

If that name is derogatory to Native Americans I would, wouldn't you?

Most Native Americans don’t find it derogatory.

 

[Alphalion75]

most, will by the new merchandise in volume that is in excess of what would otherwise be sold in every other year, no?

For an example if Penn State changed the Nitanny Lions changed to the penguins, I would by a jersey or hat even though I would want to resist the name change.

Any Economic Pro's out there please enlighten me.

Shalom

You would probably have a very large selection to choose from. I would pass on buying.

 

[roswelllion]

If that name is derogatory to Native Americans I would, wouldn't you?

Just curious. What percent of Native Americans would need to offended.

 

[DingerzForDaze]

Most Native Americans don’t find it derogatory.

https://news.berkeley.edu/2020/02/04/native-mascots-survey/

"The study’s findings, published in the journal of Social Psychological and Personality Science, show that the degree to which those surveyed identified as Native American influenced how offensive they found Native mascots.

Of those polled for the study, 57% who strongly identify with being Native American and 67% of those who frequently engage in tribal cultural practices were found to be deeply insulted by caricatures of Native American culture.

...

Overall, 49% of participants in the UC Berkeley study were found to strongly agree or agree that the Washington Redskins’ name is offensive, while 38% were not bothered by it. The remainder were undecided or indifferent."

 

[lj4heisman1]

good question, what should be the standard?

50%

20%

2%

0.5%

 

[AWS1022]

If that name is derogatory to Native Americans I would, wouldn't you?

How would you find out? Are you going to poll them? And if so, who do you decide to poll? All those that are 100% American Indian? 75%? 50%? Who gets a vote?

 

[Mr. Potter]

Just curious. What percent of Native Americans would need to offended.

I would attempt and try to answer it with this poor analogy. If I hosted a party and invited 100 people. Out of the 100, only 1 person could become ill if smoking inside were allowed. I would ban smoking inside, at the party.

 

[BobPSU92]

Brains are not behind these name changes. So yes, no-brainer.

 

[LionDeNittany]

most, will by the new merchandise in volume that is in excess of what would otherwise be sold in every other year, no?

For an example if Penn State changed the Nitanny Lions changed to the penguins, I would buy a jersey or hat even though I would want to resist the name change.

Any Economic Pro's out there please enlighten me.

Shalom

I guess that is the theory. Fans will just buy more stuff.
But then this is already happening with the jersey changing each season and these third jerseys teams have now.

The risk with changing the Redskins name is that with a name change you are essentially a new team.

Think about what makes a team. Location? That changes for many teams. The players? That changes each season. The owners? They are typically the enemy but also this changes.

Your team name... "The Washington Redskins" has a tremendous amount of value. That value is lost in a name change.

Look at some examples in the NBA of teams that changed iconic names and those that didnt despite the name making no sense.

This is why teams rarely change names.

LdN

 

[psuro]

Most Native Americans don’t find it derogatory.

Do you have documentation of that statement? Specifically the part where you state “most”

I would really like to see that data.

Thanks.

 

[psuro]

I guess that is the theory. Fans will just buy more stuff.
But then this is already happening with the jersey changing each season and these third jerseys teams have now.

The risk with changing the Redskins name is that with a name change you are essentially a new team.

Think about what makes a team. Location? That changes for many teams. The players? That changes each season. The owners? They are typically the enemy but also this changes.

Your team name... "The Washington Redskins" has a tremendous amount of value. That value is lost in a name change.

This is why teams rarely change names.

LdN

The Baltimore Bullets became the Washington Bullets abd then became the Washington Wizards.

They still suck. No change.

 

[BobPSU92]

When will the SNOWFLAKE. social media mob decide that Nittany is insensitive and decide we must drop it? Since our “leadership” will never fight it, we’ll be the Penn State Lions. Well, only until animal activists decide Lions is insensitive. By then, probably not too far into the future, we’ll just be lucky to be playing football.

 

[BobPSU92]

The Baltimore Bullets became the Washington Bullets abd then became the Washington Wizards.

They still suck. No change.

Did they shoot better as the Bullets? As the Wizards, they bring some magic, but it isn’t enough.

 

[bdgan]

If that name is derogatory to Native Americans I would, wouldn't you?

I don't want to offend anybody but it seems like people are determined to be offended these days.

 

[AWS1022]

I would attempt and try to answer it with this poor analogy. If I hosted a party and invited 100 people. Out of the 100, only 1 person could become ill if smoking inside were allowed. I would ban smoking inside, at the party.

So one person gets to decide everything? What if one person just decides to be a pain in the ass and say something bothers them? Hey, it’s not right to name a team after an animal and it bothers me....you must change the name (Bears, Tigers, Lions, etc). If only one person is bothered by smoking, they shouldn’t come to the party.

 

[bdgan]

Did they shoot better as the Bullets? As the Wizards, they bring some magic, but it isn’t enough.

Phil Chenier, Wes Unseld, Elvin Hayes, Mike Riordon.

 

[LionDeNittany]

The Baltimore Bullets became the Washington Bullets abd then became the Washington Wizards.

They still suck. No change.

Yeah that is true. But they did keep the team name through the move.

The issue for the Skins... is the new name may become synonymous with terrible... like the Wizards.

There are some people who remember the Skins being great.

LdN

 

[OaktonDave]

Do you have documentation of that statement? Specifically the part where you state “most”

I would really like to see that data.

Thanks.

The Washington Post conducted a poll on the issue. The Post article is behind a pay wall, but ESPN's article on survey is found here:

https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id...hered-redskins-team-name-washington-post-poll

I don't care for the name, but I don't have an ethnic stake in the issue.

 

[Beachwineguy]

Do you have documentation of that statement? Specifically the part where you state “most”

I would really like to see that data.

Thanks.

https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.c...redskins-name-finds-proud-most-common-answer/

 

[roswelllion]

I would attempt and try to answer it with this poor analogy. If I hosted a party and invited 100 people. Out of the 100, only 1 person could become ill if smoking inside were allowed. I would ban smoking inside, at the party.

Fair enough. If anyone is offended change the name. We differ but at least that is a consistent answer. Not being a smartass but does that extend to animals.? If calling a team a penquin or tiger or lion or duck was viewed as exploitation of animal rights you would also change? I suspect one in a hundred people feel that way.

 

[Nitt1300]

I don't want to offend anybody but it seems like people are determined to be offended these days.

including the people who don't like it when other people are offended by things that don't offend them- then they get offended

 

[Thomas1945]

I would attempt and try to answer it with this poor analogy. If I hosted a party and invited 100 people. Out of the 100, only 1 person could become ill if smoking inside were allowed. I would ban smoking inside, at the party.

I’m ambivalent about the subject matter of this post, but your parties don’t seem like a great deal of fun to me.

 

[psuro]

The Washington Post conducted a poll on the issue. The Post article is behind a pay wall, but ESPN's article on survey is found here:

https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id...hered-redskins-team-name-washington-post-poll

I don't care for the name, but I don't have an ethnic stake in the issue.

Great. I appreciate that. Thanks.

 

[Art]

The Washington Post conducted a poll on the issue. The Post article is behind a pay wall, but ESPN's article on survey is found here:

https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id...hered-redskins-team-name-washington-post-poll

I don't care for the name, but I don't have an ethnic stake in the issue.

https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.c...redskins-name-finds-proud-most-common-answer/

And a more recent survey found much higher levels of disapproval among Native Americans:

https://news.berkeley.edu/2020/02/04/native-mascots-survey/

Not my issue, so the parties can settle it among themselves.

 

[psuro]

And a more recent survey found much higher levels of disapproval among Native Americans:

https://news.berkeley.edu/2020/02/04/native-mascots-survey/

Not my issue, so the parties can settle it among themselves.

That’s what I figured...it’s an issue gaining traction

 

[Beachwineguy]

And a more recent survey found much higher levels of disapproval among Native Americans:

https://news.berkeley.edu/2020/02/04/native-mascots-survey/

Not my issue, so the parties can settle it among themselves.

I think both studies are tainted. You have the Washington Post conducting two surveys, one in 2016 and an identical one in 2019, finding 9 out of 10 have no problem with it, but how many are Washington fans? The other one is from Berkeley, a bastion of liberal thinking. How many of the participants of their survey are students, and are among those that get offended if the wind changes direction without asking them first?

 

[Tony '83]

I think both studies are tainted. You have the Washington Post conducting two surveys, one in 2016 and an identical one in 2019, finding 9 out of 10 have no problem with it, but how many are Washington fans? The other one is from Berkeley, a bastion of liberal thinking. How many of the participants of their survey are students, and are among those that get offended if the wind changes direction without asking them first?

The study by the "Berkeley" group (4 of the 5 authors were actually from the University of Michigan) included twice as many people polled as the Washington Post study (1,021 versus 504). According to the paper, participants were from all 50 states and represented 148 tribes, 17% of whom live on reservations. I mean, if could be that students were among those surveyed, but it strikes me from reading the paper that most were not.

 

[roswelllion]

I think both studies are tainted. You have the Washington Post conducting two surveys, one in 2016 and an identical one in 2019, finding 9 out of 10 have no problem with it, but how many are Washington fans? The other one is from Berkeley, a bastion of liberal thinking. How many of the participants of their survey are students, and are among those that get offended if the wind changes direction without asking them first?

Excellent point.

 

[roswelllion]

The study by the "Berkeley" group (4 of the 5 authors were actually from the University of Michigan) included twice as many people polled as the Washington Post study (1,021 versus 504). According to the paper, participants were from all 50 states and represented 148 tribes, 17% of whom live on reservations. I mean, if could be that students were among those surveyed, but it strikes me from reading the paper that most were not.

I am curious why wasn't this a University of Michigan study?

 

[Art]

I am curious why wasn't this a University of Michigan study?

Because Cal either funded or received the funding for the study.

 

[heckmans]

I would attempt and try to answer it with this poor analogy. If I hosted a party and invited 100 people. Out of the 100, only 1 person could become ill if smoking inside were allowed. I would ban smoking inside, at the party.

So, logically then, if I said that your posts offended me, and I was the only one, would you agree that you should be banned from BWI?

 

[Mr. Potter]

Just curious. What percent of Native Americans would need to offended.

If a Native American friend of mine said this was offensive, I wouldn't require him to give me a litmus test of 60%, 30%, 6%, 70% of his family and friends of similar nationality to convince me it is offensive and should be changed.

 

[BobPSU92]

I am curious why wasn't this a University of Michigan study?

Because Cal either funded or received the funding for the study.

michigan was expected by many to be awarded funding for the top proposal, but they finished third.

 

[Mr. Potter]

So, logically then, if I said that your posts offended me, and I was the only one, would you agree that you should be banned from BWI?

Tom McAndrew can answer this post. I would hope I don't offend and If I did say something that was so offensive then I should be, No?

 

[Art]

So, logically then, if I said that your posts offended me, and I was the only one, would you agree that you should be banned from BWI?

If he offends you he should get a free lifetime subscription to the Lion's Den. But, as I can amply testify, that doesn't work.

 

[Obliviax]

If that name is derogatory to Native Americans I would, wouldn't you?

The Indians, for example, discussed chief wahoo with several and reach an agreement to kill it but said Indians was acceptable. Today the goal posts are in a different place. The problem is somebody is always offended. It is now a business