At The End Of His Term Obama Trucked 30 MILLION Pages Of His Admin’s Records To Chicago Promising To Digitize Them Then Never Did

WeR0206

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2020evidence.org
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bdgan

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And not one raid.....the left ignores this
Hillary not only kept classified emails, she destroyed them when they were subpoenaed.

Then this with Obama.

I don't know enough to say if what Trump did was illegal. We'll have to let it play out. But legal or illegal there is definitely a 2 tiered system of justice.

P.S. Is it true that charges will be dropped if Trump agrees not to run in 2024? If so that proves that this is a witch hunt. They're more concerned about the politics than they are about the law.
 

maypole

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maypole

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P.S. Is it true that charges will be dropped if Trump agrees not to run in 2024? If so that proves that this is a witch hunt. They're more concerned about the politics than they are about the law.
Where did you get that? From out of your ass?
 

rumble_lion

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Trump as usual is lying.

https://www.archives.gov/press/press-releases/2022/nr22-001

The National Archives and Records Administration (NARA) assumed exclusive legal and physical custody of Obama Presidential records when President Barack Obama left office in 2017, in accordance with the Presidential Records Act (PRA). NARA moved approximately 30 million pages of unclassified records to a NARA facility in the Chicago area where they are maintained exclusively by NARA. Additionally, NARA maintains the classified Obama Presidential records in a NARA facility in the Washington, DC, area. As required by the PRA, former President Obama has no control over where and how NARA stores the Presidential records of his Administration.
 

Vic Vaselino

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Trump as usual is lying.

https://www.archives.gov/press/press-releases/2022/nr22-001

The National Archives and Records Administration (NARA) assumed exclusive legal and physical custody of Obama Presidential records when President Barack Obama left office in 2017, in accordance with the Presidential Records Act (PRA). NARA moved approximately 30 million pages of unclassified records to a NARA facility in the Chicago area where they are maintained exclusively by NARA. Additionally, NARA maintains the classified Obama Presidential records in a NARA facility in the Washington, DC, area. As required by the PRA, former President Obama has no control over where and how NARA stores the Presidential records of his Administration.
And the retards go mum.
 
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ao5884

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Trump as usual is lying.

https://www.archives.gov/press/press-releases/2022/nr22-001

The National Archives and Records Administration (NARA) assumed exclusive legal and physical custody of Obama Presidential records when President Barack Obama left office in 2017, in accordance with the Presidential Records Act (PRA). NARA moved approximately 30 million pages of unclassified records to a NARA facility in the Chicago area where they are maintained exclusively by NARA. Additionally, NARA maintains the classified Obama Presidential records in a NARA facility in the Washington, DC, area. As required by the PRA, former President Obama has no control over where and how NARA stores the Presidential records of his Administration.
Except they started moving them before 2017. The issue is with every other president, there was no raid...this was handled with negotiations and supeonas....Garland decided to go political and now they either have to charge him or explain why they did this without a good reason.
 

LafayetteBear

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Trump as usual is lying.

https://www.archives.gov/press/press-releases/2022/nr22-001

The National Archives and Records Administration (NARA) assumed exclusive legal and physical custody of Obama Presidential records when President Barack Obama left office in 2017, in accordance with the Presidential Records Act (PRA). NARA moved approximately 30 million pages of unclassified records to a NARA facility in the Chicago area where they are maintained exclusively by NARA. Additionally, NARA maintains the classified Obama Presidential records in a NARA facility in the Washington, DC, area. As required by the PRA, former President Obama has no control over where and how NARA stores the Presidential records of his Administration.
Mic drop. Dr. Conspiracy Guy punked yet again.
 

LafayetteBear

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Except they started moving them before 2017. The issue is with every other president, there was no raid...this was handled with negotiations and supeonas....Garland decided to go political and now they either have to charge him or explain why they did this without a good reason.
Perhaps you were unaware that a subpoena (note the correct spelling of that word) was issued in this case, but Trump declined to turn over many of the requested documents, including quite a few that were classified. When you issue a subpoena after some months of negotiations have already occurred - and it is ignored - the remaining options are pretty limited. You keep omitting to note that a judge signed off on this search warrant, and that Trump himself could have produced said warrant for public examination had he wanted to do so. He did not. He merely wanted to bray a bunch of specious drivel about being the subject of a "witch hunt" and a "raid." Poor baby ...
 
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ao5884

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Perhaps you were unaware that a subpoena (note the correct spelling of that word) was issued in this case, but Trump declined to turn over many of the requested documents, including quite a few that were classified. When you issue a subpoena after some months of negotiations have already occurred - and it is ignored - the remaining options are pretty limited. You keep omitting to note that a judge signed off on this search warrant, and that Trump himself could have produced said warrant for public examination had he wanted to do so. He did not. He merely wanted to bray a bunch of specious drivel about being the subject of a "witch hunt" and a "raid." Poor baby ...
Perhaps you missed the part in which it took years for previous presidents
....with no raids....again your support for a clear double standard is obvious. The funny part is it backfired....Republicans are more united now because of this politicized DOJ. Like I said either they charge Trump with a serious crime or they have some explaining to do.
 

maypole

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Perhaps you missed the part in which it took years for previous presidents
....with no raids....again your support for a clear double standard is obvious. The funny part is it backfired....Republicans are more united now because of this politicized DOJ. Like I said either they charge Trump with a serious crime or they have some explaining to do.
Perhaps you missed the part where trump (lying) said he didn’t have any more items.
Perhaps you missed the part where the National Archives said they didn’t have the problem with Obama.
Perhaps you also missed the part where a majority of Americans said the “raid” was justified, except for repiglicans.
 
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LafayetteBear

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Perhaps you missed the part in which it took years for previous presidents
....with no raids....again your support for a clear double standard is obvious. The funny part is it backfired....Republicans are more united now because of this politicized DOJ. Like I said either they charge Trump with a serious crime or they have some explaining to do.
Allow me to clarify this for you: If ANY former president takes documents that are the property of the federal government and removes them from the White House at the end of his term, without any kind of agreement with the National Archives - most especially classified documents - I want him (or her) prosecuted. Regardless of party affiliation.

Moreover, the notion that a president can declassify documents with a wave of his (or her) hand, especially nuclear related documents, and more especially AFTER he (or she) has become a former president, is just hogwash. How convenient for Trump to say NOW that "Hey, I declassified all those documents I took from the White House and would not give back!" I'm gonna go ahead and honk the B.S. Horn on THAT one. Show me some declassification paperwork that is contemporaneous with the date that he removed those documents from the White House.

And don't go telling us how it is all the fault of the General Services Administration. The GSA has already issued a public statement clarifying that, as far as the GSA is concerned, it is the duty and responsibility of the outgoing president to decide which documents the GSA packs up and removes from the White House.
 

ao5884

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Allow me to clarify this for you: If ANY former president takes documents that are the property of the federal government and removes them from the White House at the end of his term, without any kind of agreement with the National Archives - most especially classified documents - I want him (or her) prosecuted. Regardless of party affiliation.

Moreover, the notion that a president can declassify documents with a wave of his (or her) hand, especially nuclear related documents, and more especially AFTER he (or she) has become a former president, is just hogwash. How convenient for Trump to say NOW that "Hey, I declassified all those documents I took from the White House and would not give back!" I'm gonna go ahead and honk the B.S. Horn on THAT one. Show me some declassification paperwork that is contemporaneous with the date that he removed those documents from the White House.

And don't go telling us how it is all the fault of the General Services Administration. The GSA has already issued a public statement clarifying that, as far as the GSA is concerned, it is the duty and responsibility of the outgoing president to decide which documents the GSA packs up and removes from the White House.
Except all have done so....only one was raided....do you see the problem?
 

ao5884

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Perhaps you missed the part where trump (lying) said he didn’t have any more items.
Perhaps you missed the part where the National Archives said they didn’t have the problem with Obama.
Perhaps you also missed the part where a majority of Americans said the “raid” was justified, except for repiglicans.
The National Archives doesn't determine what can and cannot be taken or how long to obtain it. sit down as usual you are not up to snuff on this topic. We don't raid people's homes based on majority rule by the way.....sad i need to explain that to you.
 

LafayetteBear

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The National Archives doesn't determine what can and cannot be taken or how long to obtain it. sit down as usual you are not up to snuff on this topic. We don't raid people's homes based on majority rule by the way.....sad i need to explain that to you.
One ^^^^ of your more ignorant posts, and that’s saying something.

The U.S. government is the legal owner of those documents and records that Cheeto made off with. The National Archives is the office of the U.S. government charged with responsibility for the care and custody of those documents and records, AND for asserting the U.S. government’s rights under the Presidential Records Act.

So yes, the National Archives very much DOES have a role in deciding what presidential documents and records can be taken and kept by an outgoing President.

The National Archives does not have the investigatory powers or capabilities that the FBI has, nor does it have any prosecutorial powers (those powers rest exclusively with the DOJ), so OF COURSE the National Archives had to refer this matter to the DOJ when it became apparent that Cheeto was refusing to turn over various classified documents that he had taken from the White House despite repeated warnings not to do so, and his receipt of a subpoena demanding their return.
 
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ao5884

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One ^^^^ of your more ignorant posts, and that’s saying something.

The U.S. government is the legal owner of those documents and records that Cheeto made off with. The National Archives is the office of the U.S. government charged with responsibility for the care and custody of those documents and records, AND for asserting the U.S. government’s rights under the Presidential Records Act.

So yes, the National Archives very much DOES have a role in deciding what presidential documents and records can be taken and kept by an outgoing President.

The National Archives does not have the investigatory powers or capabilities that the FBI has, nor does it have any prosecutorial powers (those powers rest exclusively with the DOJ), so OF COURSE the National Archives had to refer this matter to the DOJ when it became apparent that Cheeto was refusing to turn over various classified documents that he had taken from the White House despite repeated warnings not to do so, and his receipt of a subpoena demanding their return.
Again previous presidents have delayed this type of thing for much longer. That's the point moron. Once again Trump is getting treated differently for political reasons. Why the double standard? The national Archives has no power to determine what is legal and what is not legal.
 

LafayetteBear

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Again previous presidents have delayed this type of thing for much longer. That's the point moron.
1. You needed to insert a comma after the word "point" in order to make your second sentence intelligible.

2. The Presidential Records Act goes back to 1978. Since then, presidents preparing to leave the White House have uniformly prepared for an orderly transition because they realized that their term in office was gonna expire shortly and they were obligated to GTFO. Preparing for the peaceful transfer of power included identifying documents they were and were not entitled to take with them, and discussing the same with the National Archives and the GSA (which does the packing). (So your statement that "previous presidents have delayed this type of thing for much longer" is just so much bull shiat.)

That did not happen in Cheeto's case. Why?

1. Cheeto was laboring under the delusion that he had won the 2020 election, and that he should have had the right to continue squatting in the White House.

2. Cheeto had no (read: zero) interest in democratic norms like the peaceful and orderly transfer of power, so he made no effort to discuss with the National Archives the disposition of presidential documents and records. He doesn't even understand or care about little things like complying with the law or protecting classified data or national security.

Cheeto needs to spend some time in prison. And to be cast down with Pard and the rest of the Sodomites.
 

LafayetteBear

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Except all have done so....only one was raided....do you see the problem?
All have done so? You mean like Obama did with those 30 million pages? The 30 million pages of unclassified documents that were moved by the National Archives and Records Administration ("NARA") to a NARA facility in the Chicago area, and which have remained under the exclusive legal and physical custody of NARA? THOSE 30 million pages?

And you guys wonder why you can't be taken seriously. You blithely swallow false reports put out by the morons at Faux News (in this case, Jesse Waters) and then repeat them. :rolleyes:
 

dailybuck777

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You keep omitting to note that a judge signed off on this search warrant, and that Trump himself could have produced said warrant for public examination had he wanted to do so. He did not.
It was not a judge but a Magistrate Judge who signed off on the warrant. The term judge when applied to a magistrate is simply a pompous fancy title for someone who is really an assistant judge was not nearly the authority of a real judge. Of course, the magistrate in this case was biased.

You apparently missed that the most important information, the affidavit, was not given or shown to trump. No way he could release it.

Also, if you taken the smallest amount of time to actually look at the Russiagate scandal, you would know that an actual judge had zero restraining influence over 4 100 page FISAs that were full of lies.
 

bourbon n blues

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It was not a judge but a Magistrate Judge who signed off on the warrant. The term judge when applied to a magistrate is simply a pompous fancy title for someone who is really an assistant judge was not nearly the authority of a real judge. Of course, the magistrate in this case was biased.

You apparently missed that the most important information, the affidavit, was not given or shown to trump. No way he could release it.

Also, if you taken the smallest amount of time to actually look at the Russiagate scandal, you would know that an actual judge had zero restraining influence over 4 100 page FISAs that were full of lies.
Yep.
 

ao5884

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All have done so? You mean like Obama did with those 30 million pages? The 30 million pages of unclassified documents that were moved by the National Archives and Records Administration ("NARA") to a NARA facility in the Chicago area, and which have remained under the exclusive legal and physical custody of NARA? THOSE 30 million pages?

And you guys wonder why you can't be taken seriously. You blithely swallow false reports put out by the morons at Faux News (in this case, Jesse Waters) and then repeat them. :rolleyes:
I mean like the ones that were withheld for years by numerous presidents (decades in some cases) yet not a single raid. Your partisanism blinds you. Double standards are the norm with you.
 

LafayetteBear

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It was not a judge but a Magistrate Judge who signed off on the warrant. The term judge when applied to a magistrate is simply a pompous fancy title for someone who is really an assistant judge was not nearly the authority of a real judge. Of course, the magistrate in this case was biased.

You apparently missed that the most important information, the affidavit, was not given or shown to trump. No way he could release it.

Also, if you taken the smallest amount of time to actually look at the Russiagate scandal, you would know that an actual judge had zero restraining influence over 4 100 page FISAs that were full of lies.
Magistrate judges may not be Article III judges, but they are judicial officers of the District Court, and they regularly review and decide upon applications for search warrants. They probably handle more warrant applications than Article III judges. So your suggestion that this search warrant was somehow suspect because a Magistrate Judge signed it is complete hogwash.

So, too, is your contention that I "missed the most important information;" that the affidavit in support of the application for the search warrant was not given to Cheeto. He was not entitled to see it in the first place. He was entitled to see the warrant and the receipt listing the items seized, and that's it. Moreover, I never suggested that Cheeto could himself make the affidavit public. Re-read my sentence that you quoted in your post. I said that Cheeto could himself have released the search warrant.

Sigh ...
 

LafayetteBear

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I mean like the ones that were withheld for years by numerous presidents (decades in some cases) yet not a single raid. Your partisanism blinds you. Double standards are the norm with you.
You're long on vague assertions and accusations of partisanship, but short on actual facts. Give me some specific examples of prior presidents who left office and took White House documents and records (classified or not) with them without first having discussed or negotiated the subject with NARA.
 

ao5884

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You're long on vague assertions and accusations of partisanship, but short on actual facts. Give me some specific examples of prior presidents who left office and took White House documents and records (classified or not) with them without first having discussed or negotiated the subject with NARA.
It took 47 years to get everything from LBJ
37 from Nixon
Obama delayed not only his own but Clinton Era records as well.

How many raids occurred?

He'll Hilary destroyed how many emails and mishandled countless pages of classified info....yet not one raid of her home. Again why the double standards. Trump gets raided after 18 months.....like both impeachments Trump gets attacked for what is just fine for others.
 

ao5884

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Magistrate judges may not be Article III judges, but they are judicial officers of the District Court, and they regularly review and decide upon applications for search warrants. They probably handle more warrant applications than Article III judges. So your suggestion that this search warrant was somehow suspect because a Magistrate Judge signed it is complete hogwash.

So, too, is your contention that I "missed the most important information;" that the affidavit in support of the application for the search warrant was not given to Cheeto. He was not entitled to see it in the first place. He was entitled to see the warrant and the receipt listing the items seized, and that's it. Moreover, I never suggested that Cheeto could himself make the affidavit public. Re-read my sentence that you quoted in your post. I said that Cheeto could himself have released the search warrant.

Sigh ...
If they have nothing to hide why fight the release?

The doj has already used bad info to secure warrants.....why should we not check to see if they are not doing so again?
 

MaconNitt

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If they have nothing to hide why fight the release?

The doj has already used bad info to secure warrants.....why should we not check to see if they are not doing so again?
What part of the affidavit is not required to be released at this time do you not understand? Trump has not even been charged with any crimes yet. Just because Trump whines about it does not make it true. If he had such a strong case why cant he find a capable lawyer to represent him?

 
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ao5884

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What part of the affidavit is not required to be released at this time do you not understand? Trump has not even been charged with any crimes yet. Just because Trump whines about it does not make it true. If he had such a strong case why cant he find a capable lawyer to represent him?

What part of if it's kosher releasing it won't be an issue do you not understand? If they are so sure of what they did why delay releasing the affidavit. Again false info was used to get warrants on Trump before....why should we blindy trust them now? There is a reason they kicked attorneys out of the search and attempted to shut off the cameras.
 
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LafayetteBear

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It took 47 years to get everything from LBJ
37 from Nixon
Obama delayed not only his own but Clinton Era records as well.

How many raids occurred?

He'll Hilary destroyed how many emails and mishandled countless pages of classified info....yet not one raid of her home. Again why the double standards. Trump gets raided after 18 months.....like both impeachments Trump gets attacked for what is just fine for others.
You're citing LBJ and Nixon?! Sigh ...

1. The Presidential Records Act was enacted in 1978, largely in response to Nixon's overreach with respect to records compiled during his presidency, including the infamous tapes. LBJ preceded Nixon.

2. We already know that Obama did not take any documents or records (either classified or unclassified) without first getting approval from NARA. Yet you keep spouting about Obama. (Some people, most notably Trump Cultists, never learn.)

3. Hillary was never president. Don't you understand that?

4. Trump got raided after 18 months because there was a period of negotiations, and then a subpoena that preceded the issuance of a search warrant.
 

jferretti

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It was not a judge but a Magistrate Judge who signed off on the warrant. The term judge when applied to a magistrate is simply a pompous fancy title for someone who is really an assistant judge was not nearly the authority of a real judge. Of course, the magistrate in this case was biased.

You apparently missed that the most important information, the affidavit, was not given or shown to trump. No way he could release it.

Also, if you taken the smallest amount of time to actually look at the Russiagate scandal, you would know that an actual judge had zero restraining influence over 4 100 page FISAs that were full of lies.
This is wrong. Search warrants commonly are issued by Magistrate Judges. It's part of the system and their warrants carry no less authority than had it been issued by the Federal Court Judge.
 

jferretti

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You're citing LBJ and Nixon?! Sigh ...

1. The Presidential Records Act was enacted in 1978, largely in response to Nixon's overreach with respect to records compiled during his presidency, including the infamous tapes. LBJ preceded Nixon.

2. We already know that Obama did not take any documents or records (either classified or unclassified) without first getting approval from NARA. Yet you keep spouting about Obama. (Some people, most notably Trump Cultists, never learn.)

3. Hillary was never president. Don't you understand that?

4. Trump got raided after 18 months because there was a period of negotiations, and then a subpoena that preceded the issuance of a search warrant.
Contrast this with the way VP Pence (R) (traitor) handled classified documents. One has fidelity to the law, the other has concern for himself.
 

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