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Anyone still on the Chambers Bandwagon?

It’s time to replace Chambers and start fresh. We need someone who can energize the fan base and get players who are capable of playing smarter more fundamentally sound basketball. And we also need the athletic department to buy into to a miner of improvements to get some fans back in the seats and introduce some excitement around this sport.
 
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Pretty amazing Norrhwestern drew 6500 today for a game against PSU in their one year renting of the Allstate Arena 15-20 miles from their campus.
 
Watkins, Carr, Reaves could make $250k-$500k a year in Europe next year. Watkins is already rumored to be contemplating it.

These guys and the guys we just landed will be gone. Count on it. Hurley and most of these other smaller school coaches have absolutely no gravitas in convincing these kids that it's better for them to stay. Few if any of these guys have sent anyone to the NBA.

You guys are talking fantasy stuff. Chambers gone means flushing a Top 25 team away for next year, guaranteeing at least 2 shit seasons, with no guarantees of success after that.
Would you regard this as a s*** season?
 
With Reaves, analytics and Vegas power rankings have us a Top 50 team this year out of 351 Division 1 Schools.

Apparently you need help with the definition of mediocre.
Defining success with preseason polling versus actual results ?
 
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And PSU is not, and never will be, a Top 25 BB program.
I disagree and I also disagree PSU doesn't care about basketball. If Coach Chambers is back next year I may have to change this opinion about PSU caring. Penn State can be and should be a top 25 basketball school. They need to get the right coach. I honestly believe they'll attempt to do this after this season ends. Build it and they will come. See our football and wrestling programs today as examples.
 
No excuses now that we have some talent! After the years of high-paid, on-the-job training, we should have won a few more close games. I'm tired of seeing Chambers lose the end game!
Chambers makes watching our Men's BB games painful!!!!!
 
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If Dread and Bolton play much next year, it will be another struggle because we are “ young “.
Not really. If everyone else is back, we'd likely start a senior, three juniors, and a soph. With what I'd expect the rest of the primary rotation to be a junior, two freshmen, and either a senior or a soph. Plugging in some numbers, probably in the top third to top quarter of the country when it comes to experience.
 
Not really. If everyone else is back, we'd likely start a senior, three juniors, and a soph. With what I'd expect the rest of the primary rotation to be a junior, two freshmen, and either a senior or a soph. Plugging in some numbers, probably in the top third to top quarter of the country when it comes to experience.
I think what’s left of the bandwagon went over the cliff last night.
 
In reference to the question in the subject line of this thread — and to quote a line from Stripes: There was one?
 
The problem is that the horses pulling the bandwagon aren’t big strong Clydesdales that work together but young stubborn mules that don’t want to work as a team.....or listen to the wagon master.
 
This is a young team. If it were to make the NCAA tournament, it would be a historical young team.

Young teams absent one-and-done talent just do not make the NCAA tournament. It's a pipe dream.

You can criticize Pat for how long it's taken but it's impossible to deny that this is one of the better performing teams in our history and next year will be one of the most talented teams in our history if he returns.

Give a guy time to get to the top of the mountain and when he gets there, kick him off?

Seems like a colossal blunder considering our status in the college basketball world. Firing Pat might be the dumbest thing we could do right now. Another reboot where all the talented players run for the hills and the current committs are released from their LOI.

Firing Pat might end up being the dumbest move in Penn State basketball history if Sandy decides to go that route.

It’s impossible to deny this is one of the better performing teams in our history?

Chambers has gotten the program to the top of the mountain?

Holy shit.
 
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I should say I feel really bad for Pat. He’s a good man. There has been no scandal around him and he has certainly given his all. He has recruited well in terms of being able to bring in some bona fide star talent, but hasn’t been able to put together a roster that will allow PSU to rise from the bottom third of the conference. We faded last season in significant part due to lack of a bench and a lack of post players. That is happening again this season. This is year seven and those problems have been consistent.
Before the season, Sandy said the Athletic Administration wanted to see some positive forward steps in MBB. While we might be able to avoid another finish tied for 12th, we are’t going to be in the middle of the pack, either. I don’t think the AD has a choice, given the HC contract status, the preseason expectations and what is already proving to be another disappointing season.
 
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People say PSU cannot be a top 25 team. Here's an excerpt from Wikipedia on ParkHill at Penn State...

Parkhill's efforts assembled a team that's generally regarded as one of the best in the history of the program, though he resigned Sept. 6, 1995 just before what proved to be a memorable season. The 1995–96 Nittany Lions, led by Jerry Dunn and assistants Ed DeChellis (now head coach at Navy) and Frank Haith (now head coach at Missouri), started 13–0 (ranked as high as No. 9 in AP poll), moved from Rec Hall to the Bryce Jordan Center, finished tied for second in the Big Ten, the school's highest placing ever, but were upset as a 5-seed in the NCAA first round by Arkansas.

Parkhill guided Penn State to four straight 20-win seasons before starting play in the Big Ten in 1992–93. All 43 seniors who played for him at Penn State did graduate.
 
If Dread and Bolton play much next year, it will be another struggle because we are “ young “.

Amazing how Kentucky can win the national championship with a squad of freshman. Our team looks like a retirement home in comparison but it is too young to even make the tournament.....
 
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Dunno. The "talent" are still sophomores. I'd like to give him until the 2016 class runs it's course. If he cannot parlay that class into growth on the court and recruiting, it's probably time.
Just remember that pre-chambers, everyone complained that PSU BB was not competitive. Now the complaints are that PSU BB should be winning a few more close games. It's a significant improvement. I'd like it to be more at this point, but it takes time to restock an empty cupboard and not sure how the depth stacks up which can lead to tired legs and losses at the end. I'm no expert, but calling for his head is potentially short-sighted. It would also depend on who a reasonable replacement would be. Hint: you've probably never heard of him so it would be a small program guy with some moderate success looking to take a big conference job and hoping he can make the leap to big time recruiting and coaching.
These sophomores have played enough basketball in their lives to know the game is played to win from beginning to end. This is a coaching problem.
 
These sophomores have played enough basketball in their lives to know the game is played to win from beginning to end. This is a coaching problem.
I'm not defending Pat, but... if, as you say, they've played enough basketball in their lives to know the game is played from beginning to end, then how is it Pat's fault when they don't do what they already know they need to do?
 
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I'm not defending Pat, but... if, as you say, they've played enough basketball in their lives to know the game is played from beginning to end, then how is it Pat's fault when they don't do what they already know they need to do?
It's coaching IMO. I'm not a big BB fan, and rarely watch any games. But when I do, our team looks disorganized and lost much of the time. Turnovers, traveling, real bad shot selection, mental errors galore etc. I tuned in at the 7 minute mark during the 2H yesterday - we were up by 2. The last seven minutes were flat out ugly and I blame the coach because he let it get totally out of control. I've watched pick-up games that had more discipline.
 
It's coaching IMO. I'm not a big BB fan, and rarely watch any games. But when I do, our team looks disorganized and lost much of the time. Turnovers, traveling, real bad shot selection, mental errors galore etc. I tuned in at the 7 minute mark during the 2H yesterday - we were up by 2. The last seven minutes were flat out ugly and I blame the coach because he let it get totally out of control. I've watched pick-up games that had more discipline.
We look that way most of the game. Has nothing to do with the players not playing 40 minutes.
 
People say PSU cannot be a top 25 team. Here's an excerpt from Wikipedia on ParkHill at Penn State...

Parkhill's efforts assembled a team that's generally regarded as one of the best in the history of the program, though he resigned Sept. 6, 1995 just before what proved to be a memorable season. The 1995–96 Nittany Lions, led by Jerry Dunn and assistants Ed DeChellis (now head coach at Navy) and Frank Haith (now head coach at Missouri), started 13–0 (ranked as high as No. 9 in AP poll), moved from Rec Hall to the Bryce Jordan Center, finished tied for second in the Big Ten, the school's highest placing ever, but were upset as a 5-seed in the NCAA first round by Arkansas.

Parkhill guided Penn State to four straight 20-win seasons before starting play in the Big Ten in 1992–93. All 43 seniors who played for him at Penn State did graduate.

The problem with Parkhill was he boinked undergrads like a pogo stick. Parents with big bucks tend to frown on that sort of thing.

As for Frank Haith, he is one of the most corrupt coaches in the game. He left Miami and Missouri under NCAA investigation clouds.
 
Amazing how Kentucky can win the national championship with a squad of freshman. Our team looks like a retirement home in comparison but it is too young to even make the tournament.....

Ok, comparing Duke/Kentucky type freshmen to other schools is just being absurd. Freshmen at Northwestern are not the same as freshmen at Kentucky who would be playing in the NBA right now if it were allowed.
 
Ok, comparing Duke/Kentucky type freshmen to other schools is just being absurd. Freshmen at Northwestern are not the same as freshmen at Kentucky who would be playing in the NBA right now if it were allowed.
And yet this year's Kentucky team, with 5 5* freshmen, is going to finish mid-pack in an SEC that isn't anything to write home about...I'm sure that it's simply poor coaching by Calipari, and has nothing to do with them being the youngest team in the country (since its been "proven" that freshmen can win it all).
 
I'm not defending Pat, but... if, as you say, they've played enough basketball in their lives to know the game is played from beginning to end, then how is it Pat's fault when they don't do what they already know they need to do?
Because he's the guy that has to provide motivation to get their asses in gear. Apparently he condones lackluster effort.
 
The problem with Parkhill was he boinked undergrads like a pogo stick. Parents with big bucks tend to frown on that sort of thing.

As for Frank Haith, he is one of the most corrupt coaches in the game. He left Miami and Missouri under NCAA investigation clouds.
Not advocating for Parkhill or that coaching staff, just making the point that systemically it is possible to have a good basketball program at Penn State
 
And yet this year's Kentucky team, with 5 5* freshmen, is going to finish mid-pack in an SEC that isn't anything to write home about...I'm sure that it's simply poor coaching by Calipari, and has nothing to do with them being the youngest team in the country (since its been "proven" that freshmen can win it all).

Calipari has won with similar rosters before and he has come out this year (as have Coach K, Bill Self and the others who get 1 and doners) and said his team is not mentally tough, physically tough or invested in the team. He basically said that the kids he gets are entitled, knowing they are going to the NBA and no longer are listening to him.

Lets say we trade Cal and Chambers at the beginning of the year. Do you think Kentuckys record is better or worse than now? I know PSU would have at least 3 more W's with Cal.
 
My big problem with Chambers the NW game is how they ran their offense. For example the last 18 mins they made no attempt to get Watkins involved in the offense.
He is one of their best players and NW has trouble guarding him but yet they didn’t even try to get him the ball in the post.

It was frustrating to watch.
 
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Consider the consequences if you fire Chambers.

- With the experience and incoming players, this is a likely a borderline Top 25 team if everyone returns next year.

- If you fire Chambers, it is much more likely Carr, Watkins, and possibly Stevens and Reaves decide to move on.

- It is also almost certain two very good players, Dread and Bolton, are released from their LOI. That has been SOP almost everywhere.

- You are giving up an almost certain tournament team next year for a complete reboot with a new coach.

- Big name coaches request premiums to coach at dead basketball schools like us. Given the profit already being made from basketball and the lack of massive upside, Sandy is extremely unlikely to spend a fortune on a big named coach. It's a high-risk, low-reward proposition to splash $3m-$3.5m on a coach here. The finances have been discussed ad naseum over at the Penn State Hoops forum. It just doesn't make sense or cents to gamble on our basketball program.

- Whether you hate him or love him as an Xs and Os guy, no sane person can deny that Chambers has built the most talented roster in Penn State history. You're going to can the guy who did that because the immature, inexperienced sophomores are acting like immature, inexperienced sophomores?

I'm not saying he's not without his flaws, but the consequences of letting Chambers go right now are damning. As a season ticket holder for MANY MANY years, it is frustrating watching us lose close games, but I tell you what, that's a hell of a lot better than the alternative for many, many years which has been leaving with 12 minutes left in the 2nd half, down 25 points.

If we fire Chambers, be prepared for the next 2-3 seasons to be brutal and unwatchable with absolutely no guarantee that the next coach will be a better alternative.


Likely borderline Top 25? An almost certain NCAA team next year haha. Sure if you say so. Wow that seemed easy to post. Why stop there? Why not put next year’s team in Sweet16 while you’re hot. I don’t believe I posted to fire Chambers. Your 5th - is correct no doubt. The outcome is this hoop program will never be big time because the commitment needed will never be in place. I guess this program probably tops out right about where it is right now. Maybe a bit higher. Alls good man. We got football and wrestling.
 
Whats inexcusable is not learning or improving in time/score situations in 7 years or at least getting someone on staff who you allow to help you with those decisions. I'm fine with the 1 more year thing for him provided there is a stipulation the make the dance or else.


Making the dance has never been a priority for this program. Anyone that come to grips with that is hopeless. Making the NCAAs is of course a stated goal every year. And the Browns coach will look a reporter in the eye this Summer and say the Super Bowl is one of their goals haha. So the dance is a goal but has never been a priority. Pretty simple.
 
All of the Chambers consternation will be moot in a couple months.

Either the program will do a 180 from here on out, and play top notch basketball, and make the Tourney. And Chambers will be on solid ground.

Or, it will continue down the road they are on - and Chambers will be out. NO athletic department would be willing to watch another two months of this level of play and not make a change at the top.


No COMPETENT athletic department. But I'm not convinced that the current PSU athletic department could not watch another two months of this level of play and just keep their hands under their butts.....
 
You may be right.

Only my personal "hunch", but I think they would make a move (assuming things remain as off-the-tracks FUBAR as they have been)

I hope you are correct. Basketball is not rocket science. There are many good game day coaches at non power 5 schools that I believe could take the talent on this team and get to the dance. And there are many coaches that can find the diamonds in the rough talent and beat teams that have talent but are poorly coached, like the current PSU situation.

Its amusing to hear some cry that if Chambers is let go that there will be a mass exodus of talent. Some of that talent may choose to leave anyway if he stays, as kids want to win and will only put up with losing for so long. It's about winning......
 
Amazing how Kentucky can win the national championship with a squad of freshman. Our team looks like a retirement home in comparison but it is too young to even make the tournament.....
Kentucky has a very profitable payroll fund to keep all of those freshmen happy.
 
I heard Urban Meyer just endorsed Chambers to keep our Head BB Coaching job!
 
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