What happened to the Cecil the lion thread?
- Thread starter eloracv
- Start date
bwifan
Well-Known Member
Now he claims he didn't know it was a local favorite lion until after the hunt.... uh says the lion was collared and part of a study and yet after you killed it you cut its head off to be mounted you would of seen the collar then no? And known something was very wrong and reported it if you were so responsible? I am a life long hunter and sorry I see no need to kill these animals in africa that are becoming fewer and fewer as we encroach on them... the thousands of white tail deer around my house chowing on my shrubs well different story. The youtube video at the bottom of the link is incredible what a magnificent animal... http://mashable.com/2015/07/28/cecil-the-lion-dentist-speaks/?utm_cid=mash-com-fb-main-link
Don't underestimate the power of the Dentist Union!http://data:image/png;base64,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
Regardless of whether he thought it was "legal" or not, you are still killing an endangered animal. For what? Fun? He put an arrow in one of the most majestic animals on earth and allow it to suffer for 40 hours and he is surprised of the backlash?
I'm a lifelong hunter, but trophy hunters like this guy are disgusting and why other hunters get a bad name.
yea that just BS. I went to his web page, linked in an online article about him and there are 75 pictures of him with every kind of dead animal you can imagine in Africa, including a rhino and leopards and warthog (he frickin killed Puumba!!), zebras and every kind of antelope !! So this guy hunts in Africa all the time so he cannot claim ignorance that what he paid the guides to do was lure this poor, semi domesticated (or at least very human familiar and non afraid) animal out of park with food to shoot it. He is in Africa all the time, based on his photos so he had to know he was shooting Cecil, but does not even matter, there is no reason imaginable to shoot a lion. Killing and eating I get, white tails (well except for the chronic wasting disease), wild hog (quite tasty) birds, small game that goes on the dinner table as long as done sustainably (well except for the hogs) but to go to Africa and pay a lot of money to kill exotic species just to skin and mount (and there s a picture of him sitting among multiple pelts and skulls) is just disgusting!!! A real pathetic excuse for a human being
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They eat lion, all forms of deer, antelope , giraffes . It's usually tradition that the meat is donated to the locals . Oftentimes they have a big feast .
Personally I've eaten deer, elk, bison, rattle snake , ostrich, bear, moose, and a few others .
People are saying , " I never ate ..... "Without realizing it. Normally the whole animal is used.
Personally I've eaten deer, elk, bison, rattle snake , ostrich, bear, moose, and a few others .
People are saying , " I never ate ..... "Without realizing it. Normally the whole animal is used.
I heard he would kill the animals while listening to the Beatles.
Except that lions aren't endangered. They are on the list as "threatened"--a lesser status. Not that I approve of this, mind you.
I think if someone wants to hunt lions, they should be given a spear and give the lion a fair chance....
bwifan
Well-Known Member
They tied a dead animal to their jeep at night a 1/2 a mile away to coax it off the neighboring reserve.... he claims he is such a great shot yet doesn't kill the lion tracks it for hours to finally kill it with a rifle what he couldn't do with a bow. Then carves up the lion ignoring the collar around it's neck showing it was part of a study of lions and claims he is a responsible hunter? This guy is a total POS... If it were up to me he would be thrown into a ring of lions in a coliseum and we all go get to watch him....
This is not his first rodeo as a game criminal, either: "According to the AP, this is not the first time Palmer has been in trouble for hunting. Palmer agreed to plead guilty in 2008 for lying to a federal agent about where he shot a black bear in Wisconsin. He was fined $3,000 and received probation."
Actually, it's worse. They tried to destroy the collar.
I say give the mighty hunter a bow, a quiver of arrows, tie some bloody zebra meat around his waist and set him loose within a 1/4 mile of a pride of lions. Have a nice day! [put that on ppv and i probably watch]
Whether or not he's a total POS, if he committed a crime he will be prosecuted.
My sense is that he realized the animal he shot when it was dead and at that point what would you expect him to do? Report himself to authorities in Zimbabwe?
Perhaps that is what people here think they would do, but most would cut bait and run. Heck we have a bunch of people saying they would punch this guy in the face on twitter and meanwhile we have a guy get stabbed to death in the subway and 10s of people just sat there and watched.
twitter mob is so lame.
LdN
bwifan
Well-Known Member
I am looking at my point of view I guess... I am a lifelong hunter and I consider myself responsible and would like to think I would do the right thing when I saw the collar. I know I would contact authorities and accept whatever was handed down to me as punishment. This guy obviously does not and has lied to authorities before about where he has shot and killed wild game. Guess I am a breed of person getting smaller and smaller as I was always taught to do the right thing even when no one was watching. I also would not be out hunting threatened or animals that are dwindling in numbers. What this guy did disgusts me on many levels...
I'm not a hunter and this guy disgusts me arguably more than you. I view hunting as killing and rather pointless.
That said, there are a lot of people who like to put themselves in situations and say they would do this or do that. Like... if I saw someone being punched then stabbed to death on the subway I'd definitely help.
Yet, apparently most don't.
Reminds me of the guy who jumped onto the subway to save someone a few years ago. All those people and only one guy does it.
There are very few people who live up to their own twitter hype.
In the end this is an animal he killed and will most likely be prosecuted for it. That's all.
LdN
bwifan
Well-Known Member
Good points... Many people don't want to get involved to help someone in need today for whatever reasons....sad. I hope he is prosecuted he is already painting himself as a victim of not knowing and believing what the guides told him and how they lied to him about certain things. This guys pattern of lying to authorities needs to be addressed and handed down punishment.
I'm with you bwi...with that said you are in a foreign country in a very vulnerable situation. In Zimbabwe with a few "guides" that are apparently questionable and I am doing whatever I need to in order to make it out of there. I would be much more willing to face the consequences in the US than those in Zimbabwe (or even worse at the hands of the guides that are not quite ready for prison).
Most big game outfitters/guides in Africa and the US follow ethical "fair chase" practices. The great majority. Obviously not in the Cecil case. But don't think the 10% or so unethical outfitters don't do this type of stuff hundreds or even thousands of times a year in Africa and the American west, especially on packaged private land hunts. Cecil was a celebrity "trophy" critter, but any poached deer or elk deserves a better fate. Whenever you talk to a guy who is bragging about some trophy western animal he shot, always ask whether it was on public land. He knows what you are asking. I know there are legitimate rebuttals to this, but I said 10%.
As a side bar, shooting a large African lion with an arrow is foolhardy at best. Too many possible bad outcomes even with heavy duty backup. Testosterone junkie jerk who could have provided some eco tourist from Pennsylvania an ugly encounter with Cecil.
A
anon_xdc8rmuek44eq
Guest
Neil Gaiman @neilhimself 11h11 hours ago
If you feel you will make the world a better place by being angry at a dentist, why not support http://www.lionconservationfund.org/join.html instead (or as well)?
If you feel you will make the world a better place by being angry at a dentist, why not support http://www.lionconservationfund.org/join.html instead (or as well)?
It's a fair point. And in many ways, I can't blame the guy for not coming forward in country... outcome could be merciless. maybe make a call once back on american soil...
doesn't change my opinion... bow, arrows (no knife for him to have ez out), bloody zebra meat around his waist to lure the big cats (y'know, he likes that luring thing)... cut him loose near a pride of lions and let him engage. i just can't get past the part of needing to lure the lion to him so he could do his trophy thing.. and even then, he can't get the job done. ahole and incompetent!
Wow, this article really brought me back to reality. It doesn't attempt to justify any actions or reactions, but it really brings sobering reality back into perspective.
http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/07/30/us-zimbabwe-wildlife-lion-idUSKCN0Q41UW20150730
"Are you saying that all this noise is about a dead lion? Lions are killed all the time in this country," said Tryphina Kaseke, a used-clothes hawker on the streets of Harare. "What is so special about this one?"
"Why are the Americans more concerned than us?" said Joseph Mabuwa, a 33-year-old father-of-two cleaning his car in the center of the capital. "We never hear them speak out when villagers are killed by lions and elephants in Hwange."
http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/07/30/us-zimbabwe-wildlife-lion-idUSKCN0Q41UW20150730
"Are you saying that all this noise is about a dead lion? Lions are killed all the time in this country," said Tryphina Kaseke, a used-clothes hawker on the streets of Harare. "What is so special about this one?"
"Why are the Americans more concerned than us?" said Joseph Mabuwa, a 33-year-old father-of-two cleaning his car in the center of the capital. "We never hear them speak out when villagers are killed by lions and elephants in Hwange."
Elsewhere in Africa, thousands have been hacked to death with machetes and no outrage
cmon fellas we can multitask
you sound like the people who constantly cry, "what about the VICTIMS??" when we discuss Paterno's legacy.
I think outrage over the 'how' (luring a protected animal from a sanctuary, 40 hours of suffering because you're using an inefficient killing process, removing/destroying the collar) can be justifiable while the outrage over the 'what' (killing a lion in Zimbabwe) is not.
These complainers amuse me, from the first hijacker to the ones from today. They are all laughable...and the only posters on this topic with an agenda. (Meanwhile, they say we are the one's with an agenda...like so much other stuff in these times.)
The original hijackers totally skipped over the most apropos comparison (starving kids in Africa,) because they are just that foolish. Or, they don't really care about live kids. Or, that is not the button that somebody is pushing on them this week.*
I never knew we had so many trophy hunters posting here. Or that they could be offended as easily spoiled children....which I suppose some of them are.
*Occams Razor cite.
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